Is anyone familiar with the red light therapy as well as near infrared (photobiomodulation) helmets and other devices on the market that supposedly improve tissue metabolism and cellular energetics?
Would this be complimentary to PEMF or do they share these attributes?
They are complementary in my experience. Both lower inflammation. Red light increases energy and unbinds nitric oxide. However, I notice one distinct difference - I am able to achieve durable outcomes with ICES PEMF if I use it long enough on the ailment whereas red light therapy helped it feel better temporarily but didn’t drive a durable outcome. ICES PEMF definitely reaches greater tissue depth. I have made other posts on my experiences using both. With ICES PEMF, seems like the more I use it (min 8 hours a day) the better the outcome. Red light therapy has a biphasic response so I don’t go over 5-10min per use no more than twice a day for the red light devices (bulb, panel) I have based on their irradiance.
Also, red light therapy is great for boosting skin repair/ collagen production.
i recently got my bulbs setup for red light using rubylux bulbs… have had the bulbs for a few years but never had a good setup to be able to use them consistently. I’m looking forward to seeing how they workout for skin healing and improvement!
the bulbs you use… are they rubylux or similar? I’m happy to read from other sources too that 10-20min use max is what is generally recommended. however, i don’t know yet how to gauge distance based on power of lamp yet. just general range of 6-12 inches to 12-36"depending on depth of penetration. 
… for now just working with comfort level and at about 18" 
on a separate note, I’ve read in some small study that red light at 670nm for 3 mins (LEDs) helped improve vision by 17% of course that’s just one study…
the bulbs i use are in the high 800 range (?) and i either closer my eyes or use the tanning goggles.
For an infrared sauna type use, I made my own 4 bulb Rubylux infrared sauna but opted after a year to go with a Relax Sauna. With my homemade sauna I had a hard time getting the temps up without a burning smell of material or burning sensation on my skin. I don’t have these issues with the Relax Sauna - it produces a reliable high heat sauna experience and my head is outside the sauna which I wanted.
For non sauna applications, using red/near infrared light, I like these https://www.amazon.com/ABI-Light-Therapy-850nm-Infrared/dp/B07SH39YT4
I also use a 660/830nm red light panel for near whole body (one side) use.
Regarding improving vision, check this out:
I started this on our 13 year old dog and his vision definitely has improved and he is much more active now! I had seen Dr. Hamblin’s papers on using red light therapy / photobiomodulation for eye conditions, but I hadn’t see until that article that it should be done in the morning. Per my other post, 660/830-850nm light stopped a floater I had as a kid when my eye was scratched by a thrown acorn.
ah yes… that’s the study i found. good you hear it helped your dogs vision… tempted to try for myself but hmmm haha i only have the rubylux in the upper 800nm range right?
I use only 660-670nm red light on my eyes. Not sure sure about the near infrared frequencies on the eyes, so would welcome anyone highlighting studies on that.
I use both as they have overlapping benefits. For me my preferred red light method is the red light wraps, as I can place them under my shirt to get the exposure
i wonder how real the emf risk is from the LEDs. I’ve been tempted to get LEDs for that wearable convenience. alas, i don’t know what i don’t know when it comes to LEDs and emf risks
My red/infrared light bulbs and my light panel haven’t had any discernible EMF using the EMF meter that @Bob recommended in this earlier post.
I use the Acustocom 2 because I think it has a good bandwidth (0.2 to 8.0 GHz) to detect EMI with potential biological effects.
My opinions of LEDs in general: As I understand it, the problem with LED lighting is the power conversion step: from 110 VAC to the lower DC voltage required for the specific LEDs. Also, properly-designed LED drivers are current controlled (not voltage controlled), so that can also add noise to the signal from the feedback loop in the current control circuitry.
But if you drive the same LEDs from a quiet (DC with no EMI) source, such as a battery, I do not think the LEDs themselves emit any EMI.
I know this partly because I have developed some extremely sensitive scientific instruments based on electro-optics (LEDs), and I was able to achieve and verify by measurement that when you use a quiet power source, the noise emitted from LEDs was essentially zero.
Keep in mind: I am not an LED expert, so this is just my semi-informed opinion.
Many of the latest panels are developed to minimize EMF and flicker.
To avoid it altogether, a pad or mini panel with built in battery or running off a powerbank, provided there’s nothing fancy like a fan or pulsing. Eliminate the AC in favor of DC.
I come from that community. I expect to continue using red light, as an M1 is limited to one place at a time, and I will have to share it with another person when I get it.
Red light is also expensive in the west, but not everywhere in the world.
i recently restarted my red light therapy now that i have a reliable frame setup for my lights… within 3 days use I’ve already noticed improvement of blemishes on my face.
I am thinking of ordering a battery operated red light wrap and was wondering which one you recommend/use?
Hard question. My pad is sold on Ebay. But although I like it now, I was disappointed in the beginning. It smelled strongly of neoprene.
The Idealight RTL12 series is quite popular now. It’s sold in several versions by companies in the US. I bought the original. It runs for 10 minutes, then shuts off.
While a pad is really comfortable to use and relaxing, a mini panel is much stronger, but covers much less area. It’s really hard to say. For detail work and travel, a mini panel is a good compromise.
Hi, this is my first reply on the forums…I’m using the blue reply button at the bottom of the thread so hopefully this is the right method. Regarding “red light” therapy, I think it is important to compare it with its big-brother: “Cold Laser”, aka “low level laser” therapy, or “red/infrared laser therapy”. (not “cutting” lasers as used in surgery, but "therapeutic, non-burning strengths). Laser light and corresponding health devices generally should show much better strength, penetration depth, and thus overall efficacy for many health issues. NOT to say that simple red LED devices aren’t effective or don’t have a place in the home healthcare space, especially given the price-points. It’s just that for more severe, chronic or treatment-resistant issues, laser may be the way to go. Here is a brief comparison of laser (coherent) light therapy, vs LED (non-coherent) technologies:
The kind of lasers that will have that effect are MUCH more expensive.
Consumer class lasers have one advantage. They don’t get warm. Many torches and mini panels get so hot the manufacturers put a timer in so they cut off after 5 or 10 minutes.
I would say my mini panel is stronger than a laser I’ve tried. I can’t comment (much) on treatment depth, as my test area isn’t that deep.
I can say that the use that laser was bought for, it doesn’t do the job well enough. So it’s time to graduate to PEMF.
If you’re talking prohibitively expensive professional lasers, then that’s probably entirely different in terms of efficacy. I just don’t want people to think consumer class lasers are super good.
There’s one area where the laser works better than anything else. But that’s a muscle right under the skin, so has nothing to do with treatment depth.
I have 3 PEMF devices, a C5, A9, and M1 that the family use almost every day. I also have a very high quality battery operated red light called the Quantum Warp 10, these were discontinued in 2017 because of FDA red tape. The Warp10 works better than the PEMF on the pain in my hand, but it is a small hand held device. My husband just started using the Warp 10 over his closed eye that was injured in an accident 11 weeks ago to see if it will help it heal. His worst issue right now is dizziness caused by the TBI. Since the dizziness is not getting any better I have finally convinced him to start using the C5 on his brain to see if it will help. He has been using a portable, seed filled heating pad heated in the microwave strapped on his lower back. I think a battery operated red light pad would be more helpful. I was looking at what is available on Amazon and am not sure how to choose from them. Thanks for your help.
Hi Jacob, just wanted to provide a few links to some random products related to this question. Of course anytime a company sells something, you have to be able to filter out “marketing” speak from actual “science” based results.
https://www.vielight.com/
https://www.multiradiance.com/technology/
Most of the units I use are from DG YAO, which don’t provide a battery. My wife finds the Plafnio shoulder wrap effective in reducing pain with each treatment, it has a rechargeable battery pack alternative.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09NDWQH5F/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I ordered the Dgyao belt with the 660 & 880 nm spectrum. My husband wants one that plugs in the wall. We have the Anker power pack, I am hoping that will work if we want to use it in the car.