Flux Health Forum

Liver health

Has anyone had improved liver health as a result of using PEMF? Specifically, I’m looking at the C5. I’ve had some success with PEMF in the past, but haven’t been able to use it consistently, which is why I’m looking for a device to use at home.

I have detox issues, which I suspect are a result of past vitamin A toxicity. When I see my acupuncturist and chiropractor, both say that liver is my weak point. I eat a primarily plant based diet, aiming for something similar to Wahl’s Protocol, though I do include some fermented dairy because it seems to help my gut. I also have ordered liposomal glutathione and vitamin C, and plan to give each of those a week or more so that I can limit variables as much as possible.

I also have some night vision issues, which I’ve heard PEMF can help with.

I’d appreciate any thoughts or suggestions. Looking forward to being part of what seems a very grounded and supportive community.

@Bob Curious if you all have any data points on liver detox/liver health using the ICES devices. It seems like it could be incredibly beneficial, especially since the liver is such a regenerative organ.

Thanks for such a supportive environment!

In addition to @Bob 's insight, @OptimalHealth did you find any gains from using it on your liver? I still haven’t tried it on the liver and have the same question as @Mama2boys.

I hope people comment on this topic with their experiences. It would be very helpful to begin to map which conditions of the liver are responsive to PEMF. There is a lot going on with the liver, and it is hard to find a place to start any sort of formal research.

I can also assure you that, after a decade of being stonewalled by my academic research colleagues, the academic scientific research community has no desire to make any real progress on this topic, but they seem to be perfectly happy to keep spending OUR tax dollars studying the clinically irrelevant minutiae of inbred laboratory mouse livers.

I am sure we can do better than that.

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The entire allopathic medicine industry and paradigm need to be brought down. I think that will finally happen with their complicity in jabberciding humanity.

I’ve been diagnosed with fatty liver disease, and I’m controlling my diet and exercise to resolve that. It’s hard to gauge how effective pemf is applied directly to the liver, especially since I don’t have any obvious symptoms or convenient measures to track.

I had a recent liver panel test and the results show my enzymes are normal. i have to schedule for an ultrasound to see the state of my liver (looking for fat in liver). I can’t say my energy levels have been noticeably affected. the whites in my eyes don’t look much brighter/different… my skin hasn’t noticeably improved in any obvious way.

My use is about 2-3x a week using omni-8 for the most part for about 6-7hrs at night using 2 ports from stacked coils on backside only of liver. I have been doing this for about 2mo’s consistently. the other 2 ports I have been using for my wife’s lower back (THAT works well to eliminate her usual pain in the mornings or later in the day).

I will try switching configuration to sandwich my liver between 2 stacked coils to see if that makes any difference too. the power level i have is generally 9 or 11.

wish I had better news. I am open to any suggestions. in the meantime, I continue to use only in hopes that it has a net benefit on my health.

I just ordered my C5 with deep field coils, and some standard ones. I’m hoping to treat my liver and eyes or thyroid at the same time. @Bob and @OptimalHealth, suggestions on initial length of time? My plan is to place them on the portal vein area, since this is the only area that’s shown up with any sort of concern on abdominal scans (and even then it was something vague, like “possibly enlarged portal vein but otherwise normal vasculature”). My sense from this forum is to start low and slow, especially since I tend toward detox issues. I have activated charcoal on hand.

Lately, I’ve been having candida symptoms, which usually shows up for me when I’m stressed or when I’m not getting enough oxygen in places. I’m hoping that the ICES treatments will help. I’ve read that ozone therapy can help, but I don’t want to introduce too many new variables at once. I’ve increased my probiotics and am increasing my veggie intake too, to try to combat the candida.

Along those lines, I assume that since PEMF seems to increase circulation, and decrease inflammation, that it would increase oxygenation of blood and tissues as a result?

Any thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.

I would say that starting low and slow is a good plan.
Please keep a close eye on any initial reactions you may have. You do not need to be in distress needlessly. Low and slow.

I think your news that your dealing with the fatty liver with diet and exercise is great. Maybe ICES is just a good adjunct? It’s awesome that your liver panel is normal, but it sounds like you work hard to keep your liver as happy as possible.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

Agree with @Bob. Start low and slow (even just 5 minutes). For our family ICES PEMF on the gut took about 36 hours before we had herxheimer reactions. Now we now how to go low and slow and use it to shift the gut without the die-off. Now we have activated charcoal, bentonite clay, clinoptilolite zeolite clay on hand if we do.

This will be worth experimenting with to see how things work for you. As Bob has mentioned in other posts, and I would agree, I would also start w/the problem area that you noted.

If you’re going to go low and slow, I’m assuming you’ll do a 1hr session at mid power, stacked? You can also try sandwiched w/one pair as well as using stacked pairs, sandwiched. How long do you plan to experiment for each variation and how will you determine if it is helping you? That’s the only concern/question I have. From what I recall in other posts about using a specific frequency before habituation may start, Bob suggested 2-3wks, but this was for longer term use (6+ hours i believe). For lack of feedback, might you just cycle thru different configurations and power levels and frequencies for a 2wk period? anyway, just something that crossed my mind.

As TajD had suggested, I’d be mindful of die-off, and perhaps, how your body reacts can be your guide to usage.

People have also found red light therapy helpful in their various ailments for healing.

In regards to ozone therapy, if you’re looking to clear things in your stomach, drinking ozonated water would be a clear choice to start… if you’re looking to get to the gut, working w/oregano oil, castor oil, and even ozonated oil. those three come to mind as i’ve personally used them topically and ingested in enteric capsules to get past the stomach acids to dissolve in the gut. there are many other things known for helping w/gut pathogens… serrapeptase, nattokinase are 2 such enzymes worth looking into (googling).

Despite all these options, supplements, technologies that we can explore for our health and specific ailments, I think the one thing I notice we all overlook or at least don’t talk about are the fundamentals. When we see a specialist, have surgery, take a med, take a supplement, use a device, etc what is the common denominator that ACTUALLY heals the body?? Everyone: OUR BODY!

All these strategies are a good way to help push our bodies into some balance temporarily, but they are non sustaining. FORTUNATELY, the things that can help our health shituation is something EVERYONE can do, but rarely do: diet, exercise, waste management, rest/meditation, sleep. these are things we do daily… the key thing we need to do is to provide the proper raw materials, nutrients, fuel that the body will need to heal itself.

This is why only recently I began to eat more vegetables, balance w/clean meats, cut sugars and carbs (go healthy keto), include cardio exercise, include breathing exercises - see wimhof breathing technique if you’re not familiar; super awesome for boosting oxygen.

The body is best to take everything we have and put in motion a good healing strategy for itself (most of the time). when it comes down to it, the driving healing factor is our bodies, and everything else we do/use/try are adjuncts.

My personal go to’s for devices are the following:

  • pemf - ICES
  • red light - ruby lux lights (i haven’t explored this as much as others have)
  • ewot - exercise w/oxygen therapy. i want to get the liveo2 type system (talk about oxygenating your body the natural/right way! this is on my wish list

I believe that when we focus on the basics and “do them well,” the rest follows. that said, part of the challenge is identifying our deficiencies and weaknesses/root causes in our bodies and then making sure we provide our bodies the sufficient ingredients it needs to heal.

sorry for the long rant.

getting back on topic… yes, PEMF can help w/inflammation and circulation, but doing 30mins of cardio @70-80% max heart rate can get things really flowing. i know it’s hard to start/do… I’ve been thinking of doing this for the last 3yrs… only now am I tired of getting by w/my health. when time/aging is against us, there’s no better time than the present to start the fundamentals - and it’s never too late to start being “healthy.”

best of luck to you!

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maybe… i can’t tell how effective ICES has been for my liver health. I got into ICES for my wife’s lower back problems (definitely helps!); and eventually for my aunt’s arthritis; another aunt’s broken arm healing; my kids’ bumps and bruises; my mother-in-law’s misstep and fall bruising her chest badly; my mom’s frozen shoulder; my friend’s tennis elbow; my kids stuffy nose from having a cold; my friend’s stiff and painful hand; my friend’s sciatica. All the above worked, except for the sciatica. To be fair, it was just using an a9 and single pair of coils. I tried this early on w/virtually no experience or knowledge like i have today (2yrs later).

as for my liver, yes… i had to adjust my diet (still working on my other bad metrics) and this may or may not have helped: NAC - this is a useful video to learn a li’l more in practical use

p.s.
forgot to mention activated charcoal… i tried that recently… the constipation wasn’t fun… i go everyday… was stuck for 2 days haha… low and slow. i took 2 capsules (600mg ea)… taking 1 was fine tho. and ya, i’m a newbie to activated charcoal, bentonite, etc… I’ve read not to take those too regularly, and to be strategic w/them…buuuuut again, i haven’t really dug deep nor have experimented much w/them.

I’ve been using NAC on a rotational basis, and activated charcoal as well. I tend to rotate through activated charcoal or Pectasol C at bedtime or after infrared sauna. I had constipation at first with charcoal, but upping dietary fiber helped considerably.

I can tell a difference with my liver function (and perhaps overall mitochondrial function) based on some odd symptoms like idiopathic neuropathy and body temperature changes. I also occasionally get upper right quadrant pain, so that’s an indicator as well. When any of these improve, then my liver is functioning better. There are also less bothersome, but still noticeable symptoms, such as dry skin and eyes that improve when my liver function is optimized. All of these are things that conventional medicine dismisses, or say don’t show up on their tests, but I still notice. Some doctors have perceived me as a hypochondriac, but I know what my body feels like when its healthy vs not, and I know it’s not all in my head. I think maybe I’m just observant, or sensitive, when others might not be so much.

I have had some outside testing done in alternative settings that revealed glyphosate toxicity, among others. So, I’m doing what I can with diet, exercise, etc. I’m hoping that PEMF will really move the needle though. I started last night with the deep field coil for just 30 minutes on the most logical location for me, and within 15 felt very sleepy. I stopped at about 30 because I was getting nauseated, which I know can be a sign that the liver is overloaded. I ate something and took some activated charcoal at bedtime. I don’t know if it’s coincidence or not, but my migraine from the day was gone when I woke up this morning, and I had two bowel movements today when I normally have one. I’ll try it again tonight for about 30 minutes and see how it goes. I’m hoping to be able to work up to longer sessions, but low and slow is the recommendation here, so I’ll stick to that.

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That’s so good that you have the level of self awareness and observation and discipline to go slow which will greatly improve your outcome in my opinion. I am curious as you execute this transformation what your cognition, energy, and presence are like down the road (several months?). What glyphosate toxicity test did you do? the Great Plains Labs EnviroTOX panel? Do you possibly live near a golf course, a rural area with farming, or in Florida? Another idea is to buy the Brain Gauge (sold on this site) and see how your performance changes as you execute this shift. I own the Brain Gauge and find it pretty amazing.

I did the test through Great Plains. I lived in a rural area as a kid, across from a cotton field. I also never realized the importance of eating organic until my late 20s/early 30s. I also dealt with loads of strep and sinus infections as a kid, and was prescribed antibiotics several times each fall/winter, which certainly didn’t support my microbiome. (But it’s what was done then, and not much was known about the microbiome at that time, so now I’m trying to clean up the mess.)

Overall, Brain Gauge is intriguing to me, but I’m much more concerned with my body’s performance than brain, though they are certainly interconnected.

I used my C5 last night at bedtime for 2-3 hours as I read to my kids and listened to a podcast. I woke up about 11 and turned it off. I didn’t have the nausea that I did the other day, but could definitely feel shifts in blood flow and also experienced hunger about 20 minutes after starting the program. Interesting stuff. I look forward to more experimentation, and hopefully healing.

Wishing you great success on your journey to health and looking forward to hearing how it goes. I also find lymph drainage very important. Rebounding or using a vibration plate are two mechanical ways to facilitate drainage that we have tried. We tried dry brushing as well but didn’t notice much of an effect, but we likely weren’t doing it correctly. We tried a couple homeopathic tonics to support drainage and didn’t notice much of an effect either. Have you confirmed you don’t have mold poisoning? I chased many rabbit holes for 5 years and only recently realized that is one of the core issues our family is facing.

just wanted to share a quick anecdote. Last night I had the opportunity to use the entire c5 allllll to myself. Usually I split it between my wife and me. She had fallen asleep downstairs and I couldn’t get her to move to her bed.

So I had 2 (2x2 coils), and 2 pairs… all stacked. In the past, I have used 2 stacked pairs or 2 stacked 2x2 coils and pulsed at about 11-13 range all night w/o any noticeable side-effect/symptoms. I wanted to focus on my gut, so I placed the stacked 2x2’s on my liver - closer to center … and the 2 other pairs stacked, placed side by side contiguous to the 2x2 stack. the 2 pairs basically covered the hepatic portal vein and maybe a bit towards right side where pancreas is (about an inch+ to the right of center). Set my c5 to 12 and let that go for maybe 8-9hrs over night on omni 8 setting.

I woke up to a frontal lobe headache… somewhat throbbing at about 5 out of 10 pain. it was “nice” to wake up to that in that I was able to get some kind of reaction from the pemf. haha… i am assuming the headache was from detox. was a pleasant surprise… I then moved the coils to my head, laying down on my side. I placed 2x2 on left side of head between head and pillow and other 2x2 on right side of my head. I placed 1 pair stacked at front of forehead and the other pair at back of head. Changed the pattern to alpha, set to 6 and let that go for 30mins easily.

I’ve tried using ices for my wife’s headaches/migraines to no avail. I rarely get headaches and when I do, it’s usually from some detox in overdoing some supplement where I would just take L-Ornithine (4g) and headache all gone. side note: this works bc usually whatever die off i’m dealing with generates a lot of ammonia… L-Ornithine nicely counteracts that excess and my headache is resolved w/o having to take some drug (yay me).

Using ICES for my headache, this was the first time i had “full coverage” at deep coil setting… headache disappeared within 5mins… I kept it going for a good hour resting in bed. it was a lazy sunday (late) morning.

I imagine my gut ices blast helped the healthy microbiome and maybe in that process the die-off of whatever was healing in my gut caused the headache in the morning. I wish I had more details as to what was going on in my gut. I can only guess a good amount of die-off happened last night, hence the headache i almost never get.

My wife’s back is acting up, so I’ll have to relent all use to her this week.

the experiment continues!

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Thanks for the tip on l-ornithine for headaches from dieoff.

If you don’t usually have diarrhea, did you have diarrhea within 24-48 hours of this? My experience with ICES PEMF on the gut or anywhere on the abdomen area is that it will cause diarrhea if there is any microbiome shifting caused by its use.

no…in fact i didn’t go today at all. kinda bummed. it may be that i took too much de the night before. I’ve been inconsistent so my body might need to readjust… too much and can get a bit constipated.

L ornithine only works if your type of die off creates excess ammonia. i started with 500mg… nothing…1g total… nothing…2-4g for me seems to offset whatever my liver can’t handle. Google for details (I’m sure you already have)

i have not ever had any real gut issues… the most activity I’ve had is gas and maybe an eventual bm.

I’ve been meaning to share/ask you about this… have you tried a liver/gallbladder flush yet? I’ve been taking lemon n acv 2x daily for the last week… I’ve considered doing this flush, but i want to clean up my diet and reset first while taking lemon n acv.

these accounts were enlightening: