Flux Health Forum

ICES water / structured water / magnetic water

Other Interesting Applications
#1

I started this thread specifically for getting feedback on how people are using their devices to prep their water and hopefully hear any creative and useful applications with water.

i do have a question (actually a few come to mind) that hopefully our resident scientist @Bob might be able to address:

  1. how do we know how long to “cook” our water? if we have an 6oz cup vs a 32oz cup what strength and amount of time would yield what % of saturation… or how do we even quantify this saturation or power?
  2. is there a way to also measure the half life of the magnetic… saturation?
  3. assuming this is the magic sauce behind the ionic water created thru electrolysis, would it be accurate to say that light, heat, and time will affect/erode the magnetic properties (power/saturation) of the water?
  4. does elevation (sea level, higher elevation) affect time (to magnify) and half life? guessing not :thinking:
  5. what minerals or ingredients can enhance, affect the making of ices water?
  6. what measurable characteristics can we use to determine the quality of ices water produced?

on my personal prep for ices water, i hope to fully saturate my water. i use a glass French press without the metal press/pushdown top. using an a9, i have stacked the coils or put them across from each other (bumpy side out) or part time of each. i typically set power to M and let it run for 30 mins for a 32oz of water.

Novel home remedies and other uses for minor injuries
#2

I don’t think there is a lot of information on this topic, so I would say that the honest answer to most of your questions is essentially “unknown”.

That being said, from personal experience I would say the effects are easy to feel. And I think it would be possible to start answering many of these questions if people experiment, keep careful and detailed records, and most crucially replicate the conditions of each test independently.

From experience I do have a partial answer for #1: it only takes about 2 minutes. But this probably has many variables (literally almost any variables you could think of), but I would say that a small glass (4 - 8 oz) of spring or RO filtered water take only about 2 minutes at a medium-high setting (9 or 10) at 4.0 or 4.2 Hz. Much longer is too long IMO. It becomes unpleasant to drink.

Here is an experiment:

get a gallon of your favorite water

put 4 oz into a drinking container (non-metallic)
Treat with PEMF for 30 seconds, take detailed notes on what you taste and what you feel.

About an hour later, using the same treatment setup
Treat for 1 minute, take detailed notes on what you taste and what you feel.

Repeat every hour or so, doubling the treatment time each time you do this.

Report the results back here.

EXPERIMENT #2
Now that you know how long to treat 4 oz of water, try varying the conditions and repeat the pattern above. For example, for a fixed treatment time that you determined was “best”, now try treating different volumes of water: 8 oz, 16 oz, etc.

Take detailed notes: does it require longer treatment times or not?

You can vary any experimental parameter this way.

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#3

I just finished listening to the audiobook version of the book;
“The Fourth Phase of Water: Beyond Solid, Liquid, and Vapor – 2013- by Gerald Pollack”.
This is a great book and it describes that liquid water when in contact with a hydrophilic surface and by absorbing radiant energy, starts to transform into crystalline water that is a gel state of water (10% more dense then bulk liquid water), commonly known as Exclusion Zone (EZ) water, or structured water. liquid bulk Water in contact with hydrophilic surfaces (which can be the container or the contaminates within the water), absorbs radiant energy from all visible wavelengths including Infrared. 3000 nm of infrared light was found to most effective at creating EZ water but 7.5 Hz of Ultrasound was also found to create EZ water. Scientists found that UV wavelengths were not very effective at creating EZ except for the narrow wavelengths around 270 nm of UVC. So to measure the presence of EZ water scientists use instruments that give off a wide range of UV and measure how much 270 nm of UVC are absorbed compared to other nearby UV frequencies.
@Bob have you read this book? It holds lots of clues how to study ICES water.

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#4

Interesting observation. For me, I don’t notice a difference when drinking or a difference in effects if I pulse my 16oz glass of water for 2 minutes or 2 hours.

#5

yes, and I have talked to Gerald Pollack several times over the years. This is all very interesting, and it is pretty clear that the mainstream understanding of water in all of its phases is not so well understood as is generally claimed. But here is the trap: you can spend thousands of lifetimes studying the minute details of a system (a single molecule, for example) without zooming back out to see the basic, simple impact of all of this on an actual, real, living system. What happens is that people go down the rabbit hole and never resurface again.

Most life scientists would violently disagree, because this is the basis for the way money is hustled from the federal government to sustain endless and usually non-useful studies of biology. But look at recent events with the pandemic:

100 years since the last viral pandemic
60 years of very expensive, detailed molecular studies of viral particles
NIH spends many billions of dollars on viral research at the molecular level

then… lets see how well all of that has served us

A new pandemic hits with a slight variation on a known family of viral particles.

The total number of effective tools we have to deal with this new virus are actually fewer than what we had a century ago:

Wear a mask: 100 years ago: definitely, today, well maybe
Keep your distance: 100 years ago: definitely (many schools were held outdoors, for example), today: just start cramming people together again too soon, to “restart the economy”.

But with all of the academic research done in the intervening decades, we have developed no widely accepted generic tools to combat a pandemic like this.

This is just one of hundreds of examples of what the wrong focus in research will yield; lots of data, nothing of practical use.

So, lets say for example I drop everything, and work on the molecular details of structured water for the next 10 years. Lets say I am wildly successful and publish precise values for changes in molecular arrangement, density, light absorption.

But we are then still left with all the same basic questions: does it really benefit health? What are the basic, simple, practical recipes?

We really would not know anything of real practical importance. So, I am not going to charge down that rabbit hole.

BTW, a few years ago, a few very prominent people got very interested in GP’s research. They provided a large amount of resources expecting massive breakthroughs in structured water. And the result after lots of $$$ spent and many years: nothing really.

If you look carefully, history shows you its dead ends.

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#6

Good observation. So, then it comes down to this: Are there conditions under which it does overcharge the water. What are the experimental conditions (too much exposure time? intensity? coil orientation differences?) How do people sense this? What are the effects, if any, and what percentage of people sense this versus what percentage do not.

Once you have established observations of this kind, from several independent observers, then you start looking for more details and molecular mechanisms.

#8

I cant understan what is difference between ionic and molecular compounds?

#9

Seems interesting as for me.

#10

Hi @Bob,

do you know if there’s any problem pulsing water through a steel or metal container? does it dissipate/weaken/negate/negatively affect the intention of magnetizing the water? i have an RO tank i would love to just pulse vs pulsing little 1-2 liter containers of water.

I’ve been pulsing water daily and that’s all the type of water i try to drink, so I’ve mostly overcome or have gotten used to the detox effects i used to get. i suppose i can (will later) taste test the water to see if it still works thru metal tho.

i thought I’d ask in case you knew vs relying on a subjective taste test. but as i write this, i think the taste of district enough to have an idea of if it still works.

hmm…i guess i found a way to answer my question, but I’ll ask here anyway haha.

thanks!

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#11

@OptimalHealth I too have been drinking only structured ICES PEMF pulsed water since the original threads on the topic. A couple things I may be seeing but who really knows as this is subjective based on my observations: less gray hair (as noticed by family members) and ICES PEMF on joints/ligaments seems to produce faster results. Do you notice any difference between drinking water that has been pulsed for 10+ minutes versus 2 minutes?

#12

That’s a good question, and it relates to any situation where a conductive sheet is placed between the ICES-PEMF coils and the thing you want to stimulate (water, tissue, whatever). So, these comments should be taken as generally true.

To understand this, the first thing you need to understand is the physics concept of eddy currents.

Any time a changing magnetic field tries to go through an electrical conductor, it will cause tiny electrical current loops in the conductor, and these will suck energy out of the changing magnetic field. This broadly is true for any type of changing magnetic fields passing through any type of conductor, such as metal plates and sheets.

That’s the theory. It involves a lot of math. And it depends crucially on (1) how fast the magnetic field changes, and (2) how electrically conductive the conductor is where eddy currents are being formed. The practical reality is that magnetic fields are highly variable in their rate of change, and you do not know it unless you measure it (which I have done many times), and sheets of conductors are of highly variable conductivity. For example, a copper sheet is much more electrically conductive than a steel sheet, so copper will form eddy currents more easily, so copper will block changing magnetic fields from passing through much better than steel sheets will. This is why they use copper foil and paint and plates to shield from electro-magnetic radiation, for example. And as a practical matter, no conductor is so perfect that it shields out all electro-magnetism.

With this in mind, my answer to you is: it depends.

Any conductive bottle or container will shield out some of the electro-magnetism of ICES-PEMF. The shielding will not be perfect, but it will shield some of it. How much… you would have to do the math, or better yet, measure the effect directly. I have done this for several types of material, and the fact is that some ICES-PEMF pulse energy does get through. But some is lost. And it depends on the exact material, the thickness of the material, etc.

So, in the end I would say your best strategy would be to do the taste test, and see for yourself, unless you have the time, money, and expertise to build a test setup for your specific set of physical circumstances.

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#13

thank you for the educational response. taste test it is haha.

i refer everyone i know who may benefit to this forum so that they can cut thru the marketing hype of the pemf industry.

thank you for all that you do. you are definitely one clarifying point in an industry and technology that is shrouded in mystery bc of the lack of scientific development in this field!

#14

glad to hear you’ve continued and are perceiving benefits from the ices water too!

i can only tell you from experience the difference in pemf water vs non pemf water. bc I’ve only been focused on doing what works vs (hopefully) measurable experiments with how long to pulse.

i have gone without ices water for 2 weeks and have noticed a qualitative diff in my gut and eventual end results (:poop:) on ices water. i have especially noticed similar beneficial results in my family’s use as well. suffice it to say… more artifacts (similar pattern everytime ices water used) are released -and, no, it’s not undigested food. I’ve ruled that out by logging what has been eaten over a period of time.

on a separate and very overlooked health topic, i believe 100% that this ices water is an absolute essential in detoxing the body of… (at least helminthic) pathogens in the gut. works arguably better than meds, but definitely great as an adjunctive therapy.

the topic of pathogens in our gut is so sadly overlooked and diminished in mainstream medicine. lyme disease is only now starting to get more recognition than it has in the past (finally). alas, that is the tip of the iceberg. the symptoms you’ve mentioned are common in those affected by external factors (pathogen related). bc this factor is dismissed outright for lack of education in mainstream health, many can easily be misdiagnosed without ever finding the root problem of their health issues. very frustrating my healing journey has been… but i digress.

to answer your question… i have not tested 2mins vs 10+mins… for a 14oz ceramic or glass cup, i just pulse away over 10+mins usually on a stacked coil, sometimes across from each other at high on an a9.

i can probably get away with 2mins for that setting and amount of water tho i imagine. sorry i can’t be of more help in your question!

#15

@OptimalHealth Thanks for sharing your observations - very interesting. I too pulse water for any number of minutes. I have had similar experiences personally, but more interesting than my experience - I am about to do a gut test on a family member to see if structured water is the highest return/ least die off way to shift the biome with the least effects of die off (something we have struggled with in a particular family who can’t benefit from liposomal glutathione or NAC due to transulfuration pathway issues). Even 1/10th of a drop of Researched Nutritionals BLT/per day is too much and yet adjusting to 4 ounces of water caused manageable dieoff (and more clarity post herxing) even though nearly everything else causes unmanageable dieoff symptoms. Getting out of the inflammation cascade and shifting the microbiome can be one of life’s greatest challenges in my opinion.

#16

I’m hopeful the ices water will continue to improve gut health. with such an acute case, it sounds like there will be plenty to notice in quality of life. :+1:t4:

#17

so today i had the opportunity to pulse my double walled steel insulated water canister for about 3 mins on 20oz… the taste was noticeable than just the standard ro water, which usually tastes flat in compassion.

while i was at it, i also taste tested tap water vs ices tap water pulsed for over 5 mins on 8oz glass… the taste certainly was not as noticeable as i can only guess tap water has more contaminants than ro water. however, i was still able to detect a “sharper” taste for lack of a better description.

lastly, i stacked my coils and affixed them to the ro storage tank. i left it ticking away for over 20 mins on a the food grade steel tank and success…3 gallons of ices water for all to benefit by ice, fridge water dispenser and ro spigot (all connected to the tank)!

now i don’t have to look like a maniac pulsing and policing every container of water poured. instead, i can just pulse the milk and juices in the fridge and have my bases covered for everything the family drinks.

as you can imagine, my kids have grown used to my pulse prepping their drinks when around to catch them… the wife, not so much and thinks i need to see a professional :man_shrugging:t2::grinning:

at this point, i begin to wonder how heat affects magnetic properties. as i have read in the past, i believe heat destroys any “magnetic enhancement” to the water. I’ll take room temp and cold ices water tho!

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#18

Many of the common steel alloys are not very good electrical conductors (relatively speaking), and I have tested the penetration of ICES-PEMF through thin plain carbon and low alloy steel sheets. There is significant magnetic pulse penetration in many cases, by my measurements, so I am not at all surprised to hear that it is working for you.

#19

@Bob do you have any feedback about pemf on fungus, mold, bacteria, etc. that is a risk in build up over time in water storage tanks?

meanwhile, i think I’ll look for a way to grow bacteria to test with pemf and then measure or at least have some visual test of bacteria growth in a petri dish to get an idea.

just thought I’d ask in case you have real data about this.

thanks!

#20

There have been some studies on this, most notably I think the doctoral dissertation from Australia in ~2013 which showed that 10 Hz square wave PEMF had a slight (~10%) but not statistically-significant effect (reduction of growth rate) on two forms of common bacteria of clinical significance.

Other than that, I have not seen very much. And all of this was done in vitro, not in a living human. And I do not think that it has ever been shown that PEMF actually increases microbial growth or proliferation. So I would hypothesize that the use of PEMF to improve the health of living tissues may also, indirectly, be helpful in enabling those tissues to better fight off microbial attacks. But that has never been demonstrated, so far as I know.

#21

I’m wondering if taking a bath in pemf water would have an health of with arthritis issues.

Anyone have any ideas about this?