Flux Health Forum

ADHD and PEMF / ICES

First-time poster, mid 50’s with life-long ADHD. I’ve refused the standard “stimulant” meds so far, with not great results. Curious if anyone has had any luck with PEMF/ICES for improving ADHD symptoms, such as executive function, working memory, focus, impulsivity, etc. Considering buying the M1 or C5, seems like the two main MoA’s would be brainwave entrainment, boosting biological activity in the PFC, or maybe a synergistic combo of both. Most practitioners would prefer to take a baseline QEEG first to see which bands are deficient and/or excessive. ie, too high theta, and too low beta. Considering a QEEG can cost over $1K, thinking maybe I could just start experimenting on myself to boost SMR, low-beta, and maybe gamma, using the ICES programs, which research seems to show is deficient in ADHD. I’ve tried the “NeoRhythm OmniPEMF” headband for about 6 months, on custom settings of 14.3, 16 and 40 Hz, with no noticeable effects so far. This device max power is 25 gauss (2.5 mT). Dr. Pawluk seems to think higher strengths are needed to make measurable impact on human tissue and organs. I have a few related questions, if anyone could please chime in with either objective observations or conjecture:

    • Any bio-hackers or others out there with any thoughts or observations of ICES/PEMF impact on ADHD/Exec function?
    • Anyone tried any live EEG monitoring during an ICES/PEMF session, to see if the EEG would match the target frequencies driven by the device?
    • Would the extra power/penetration depth of the C5 vs the M1, be noticeably more efficacious, factoring in the cost difference and portability factor?
    • Anyone seen QEEG, SPECT, fMRI, conners, TOVA, etc, provide any quantitative, objective data, pre and post ICES. In lieu of those diagnostic tools, has the “Brain Gauge” provided any correlative data as such?
    • Any suggested protocols, PPS, strengths, config and placement of the coils, for improving PFC/ADHD/Exec function symptoms?

Thank you kindly.

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I biohacked my way to be ADHD free with ICES PEMF - it was all driven by gut dysbiosis - see my many other posts on this topic. This involved using coils on the gut along side binders so as to not trigger herxheimer reactions - not using the coils on my brain. In working to remediate ADHD, I also increased my presence and awareness which has improved so many dimensions of life. Brain Gauge is an awesome tool to benchmark brain health and track material changes impact on brain performance.

M1 is just fine for the gut and for head - portability is so awesome. I recommend the Brain Gauge + M1 combo over splurging for the C5 first. I bought the c5 a couple years after the M1 & Brain Gauge. My 13.5 yr old dog sleeps on the c5 18+ hours a day.

I rotate every month or so between Alpha Power 9 or Omni 8 Power 9. When I have a migraine, I double stack the coils on Alpha Power 15 on my head and the headache goes away after approx. 1 hour versus lasting all day until sleep.

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Ok, I have zero personal knowledge of ADHD and my ICES experience extends to tendon use only. However, coincidentally I was just listening to a podcast of a guy who wrote a book on ADHD and it seems he proposes a complete reframing of the problem. So my apologies if this is useless but I remembered it and maybe it’d be useful: https://www.amazon.com/ADHD-Hunter-Farmers-Thom-Hartmann/dp/162055898X

coincidentally and to add to @wondering, i came across this podcast… an interview with ratey who has done a lot of research in helping with add… in a nutshell their research has found a level of exercise has helped with symptoms as well as boosting neurochemical activity giving an array of benefits.

i know it’s not pemf related, but it’s such a good podcast to listen to [Brain Science with Ginger Campbell, MD: Neuroscience for Everyone] BSP 111 Exercise and the Brain (Encore) #brainScienceWithGingerCampbellMdNeuroscienceForEveryone
https://podcastaddict.com/episode/106490253 via @PodcastAddict

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forgot to share this one … an interview w/Dr. Ratey:

Do you have pictures of placement on your gut?

I don’t have pictures, but it has been side by side coils right below the naval.

I am sharing this in case someone else finds it helpful.

I bought an M1 a few years ago, and have used it sporadically since. The reasons for not using it include that I was not certain it was doing anything to help despite what I read, and probably I was looking too much for instant gratification of feeling “better” immediately after using it, or feeling at least some kind of improvement. I have lots of places where this is applicable, particularly with hip pain. Having said that, I have no guide to learn what frequencies to use, where to place it, etc.

However, I also have ADHD. (Maybe that also has something to do with my ability to be diligent in the use of this machine…anyways).

I have a machine called muse, it is a consumer level eeg that the company sells and gives you neurobiofeedback in an attempt to help you to calm your mind while meditating. I got it around 6 years ago and have gone through periods of frequent use, and then not used it for periods of time, but the consistent thing about it was the inconsistency of my results and complete lack of progress when devoting consistent time and effort to it.

I have tried ADHD medication and it did not seem to help, either with my ability to focus nor my meditation results. There was a time that I felt that the machine must not be reading properly because I feel like I am calm but the results say the opposite. Other times I could have a great session but not really feel like I had done anything differently, and occasionally I would feel like I was calm and focused during my session and the results would show it. In the last year, Muse also released an updated software app that seemed to give me even worse results than before, like the algorithm for what “calm” was had changed somehow.

In the last few days, I read the post from TajD here about biohacking himself to be free from ADHD by putting the coils on his abdomen. I was sceptical but I will consider almost anything at this point. I use the Muse machine with another app called Optibrain that gives some kind of brain imaging of the different waves and activity in the brain, I just started using it a few days ago.

Today I took a break from the computer to go and meditate. I relaxed for a few minutes on my bed and then put the Muse headband on and did a 15 minute session. I had 24% calm, a bit worse but not as bad as I have had at times before. I then thought to myself, what would happen if I put the M1 coils on my abdomen and meditate? I also have a red light, so I thought I would shine it on my face/head at the same time.

I did it again for 15 minutes with the coils running the OMNI 8 program at 12 power and the red light on my face. This time…birds chirping constantly (the feedback has bird chirping noises when you are in a calm state). It was 67% calm! I believe that is the highest score I have had since they updated their software.

A sceptic might say that I had gotten calm from the first session and that is why I did better on the second one, but I can tell you that I have done two 15 minute sessions before back to back, many times, and that never happens. I have also seen that my calm score is higher right after waking up in the morning, and this was in the mid afternoon and usually at a time where the results aren’t great.

I did feel a little different in the second session compared to the first. It was subtle but noticeable to me. If I did not have this tool to measure it though, I would not have necessarily thought much of it. But if it can make that much difference to me immediately in a measurable way, I am excited that I think that I finally have a starting point to figure it out and that consistent use in this way over time will start to show significant results for me. Being on my abdomen, I think it may also help my hip, or maybe my brain behaving will help the rest of my body, including my hip.

I have attached screenshots of the meditation sessions as well as the images from a before and after brain scan. I can’t read too much into those as I don’t know much about brain activity, but I can say that the after PEMF image looks VERY different than the before.

I will continue to do it and test, but it also opens up a new set of questions for me. If it is the stimulation of the vagal nerve that is causing my mind to be calm, is it because it is just mitigating an issue that is already present? Is my microbiome in that poor of condition that it is the root of my ADHD? Or is it something that is damaged or injured and consistent PEMF will cause it to heal? I have thought that I eat quite healthily overall except that I don’t probably get enough vegetables frequently enough, but I am no longer looking at my head as a problem but my gut.

Note, I was going to upload 4 images but because I am a new user I can only upload one. I will try and add the other on follow up replies, or if I can’t, then a mod will have to give me access to do it.

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Where do you apply the coils please?

@ta

@RealThing Does this help?

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yes I’m trying that, thank you! Much appreciated.

As a follow up to my post, it appears that it is not the PEMF that is causing the changes, although I am sure it is not hurting and may also be helping, but it is the red light bulb that is having the primary effect.

Which bulb are you using? Have you considered doing intranasal red light therapy? Given your success with the red light bulb, perhaps it would be worth trying. They are like ~$30 USD on Amazon.

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Hi all, I am new to the forum and just got my device in the mail. I would like to use it for my son’s inability to focus on non-preferred tasks. Does anyone have any experience with settings and placements beyond what I’ve read here (forehead, back of the head and abdomen) that they have played with and got some interesting results? I would like to try anything and everything someone has tried and see what seems to work best for my son. He is also very prone to irritation and elevated tones when he can’t communicate well. I know this is due to his brain is still developing and all input kinda runs through the amygdala since the front of the brain is still developing at 16, so they’re prone to getting agitated when they feel stressed. ANY thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated for this mom that has tried many things to date :slight_smile:

Check out Dr Pawluk’s website and search his blog for suggestions on coil placement.
The resources on this excellent Forum are good. PEMF is great depending on what is causing his behavior issues. I have learned from personal experience that you do need to dig deeper because there could be something else going on. The symptoms you are describing could also be related to heavy metal toxins, especially lead exposure, even LOW levels can cause problems that are made worse for chemically sensitive children and adults. Tamara Rubin has dedicated her life to getting the information out about all of the products we use every day and the risks. She experienced this first hand with her family. She posts product names for the ones that tested positive for heavily contaminated and which ones tested as safe. A perfect example is my 15 month old great-grandson and granddaughter, they were snacking a lot on Goldfish crackers which tested as contaminated. There is a very popular name brand organic dandelion detox tea that I used to drink, it tested off the charts for contamination with cadmium, lead, and many other toxins. Thanks to Tamara we can now make safe choices. Children are very vulnerable to heavy metal toxins, not just lead. Tamara posts the heavy metal toxin results for the testing from reputable labs. She is on social media and has a website… Her business name is Lead Safe Mama, website: leadsafemama.com another resource is the website: Mamavation.com

Another suggestion. I recently had DNA testing done and used a company called Molecular Health to do a Personalized Report & Protocol for my extensive health issues. I learned that I have the top 7 most common genetic variants that cause the most health issues. I made many changes to my diet and supplements, and removed many that were wrong for me and actually making my health worse instead of better. I added the right ones that I needed for my specific genetics. It has been the best thing I ever did for myself. I only wish this was available so I could have done it years ago. I was so impressed I purchased 5 Bulk Reports at a big discount, and had my close family done, including my great-grandson.

It is not always just one thing, it can be a combination of his age, combines with several other issues. I have had to many doctors that are trained to get their prescription pad out as a cure all because they do not have any experience or training with alternative treatments like epidemics DNA related issues and PEMF most have never heard of it. My current PA is very interested in learning more about other options, I wish more of those who work in the medical profession were. With my husbands recent knee replacement, he made the mistake of mentioning the reason why he was healing so fast was because of his C5 PEMF. The surgeon was actually lost his temper and yelled at him. He had never heard of PEMF. He did apologize after he got on his computer and looked it up. You would think since there are some PEMF devices approved years ago by the FDA for healing bones that he would have known this.

What work have you done on his gut? We have found great up regulation of cognitive function by using Omni 8 intensity 9 on the gut. However, in our case, it did cause dieoff the first two days as pathogenic gut species were flushed out. What have you tried and what results have you gotten? There may be some clues in your experience set that could help inform a best guesstimate on where to start and how to evolve the experimentation with ICES PEMF.

Thank you so much for the suggestion TajD! I literally just got my device a few days ago and have not tried anything on him yet. I will try using it on his belly and will keep your Herx reaction warning in mind. I appreciate your response!!

I’m sorry the doctor yelled at him, thats unprofessional and out of line. I’m glad he apologized. They can never look beyond what they’ve been conditioned to use unfortunately. And unfortunately the medical industry today are not in the healing profession, they are in the cause-symptom-and-manage-them profession. Even though they think they are helping they cause more issues than they fix.

anyways, I got his metals tested when he was little and there wasn’t anything that stuck out needing a chelation detox. We tested for allergies and it was just grass he was sensitive to but we didn’t have grass. We did dietary stuff but eventually, after years of seeing too many professionals, I found one doctor that said it was attachment trauma. We did work in that arena and it made a huge difference but when the school all went online with covid, all his symptoms came back from the use of electronics…so here I am now trying PEMF

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For trauma in a child, I have seen Bach flower remedies, recommended by an energy practitioner, to have an amazing effect in our case. This is also an “energy” type treatment based on the resonant frequency of the particular Bach Flower remedy (there are something like 27 Bach flower essences) . Have you tried this?

One more idea is to buy (though I know another expense for parents trying to heal their kids is never welcome) the Brain Gauge (also sold on Fluxhealth.co) and have him use the Brain Gauge Gym 20 minutes a day. For my family, I am glad we have both ICES PEMF as well as the Brain Gauge. Dr. Bob Dennis and Dr. Mark Tommerdahl run this site and they are the two scientist in the Grumpy Science videos. So real engineer/scientists that have absolutely understated products (their specialty is not go to market but creating real products and just putting them out there for the world to find organically/ by word of mouth) that are surprisingly effective.