Flux Health Forum

Thoughts on PEMF Manufacturers

wow… with a machine that looks that cool… who cares if it works. amazing. these guys in Mexico had similar noble gasses filled glass articles integrated into some of their devices…

this is the Theraphi Scalar device you had mentioned.

Looks cool. The people that design such things must have advanced knowledge in scalar, quantum-field and / or aether-physics and mathematics to calculate the exact geometry of their devices, figure out the exact diameter of copper wires, power, current, frequencies and the like. Hopefully they have read at least Meyl’s books.

I had also such a “scalar” device. “Had a nice glow”. The manufacturer did not reply on any (technical) questions not did explain anything in depth on his web site. Oh, I forgot, the devices was also “plasma” and “Rife”, too. A Scalar-Plasma-Rife machine. May be cool if it works, but I could not figure out how to test that. People on a support group of that device ask all for the “right” settings for XYZ, but no one answers or posts his experiences like “setting Q for P” or the like.

Sorry, I could not resist. :nerd_face:

Best,
hans

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Yes that was my impression of forums for devices like the spookyscalar2 or whatever it is called. They just seemed to want obedient people that do not ask questions or post anything interesting or relevant. Also the fact that it was made in china made me a bit suspicious of the fact that no one was able to ask real questions about the devices other than how to turn the knobs.

To be honest I am not an intellectual. Having said that, some of the devices that I have come across are directly designed or reproduced based upon the works and working models being reversed engineered of Nicola Tesla, George Lakhovsky, and Paul Marie Oudin. Having said that, it also means that is it quite old technology that was suppressed with the advent of ‘modern medicine’ and Carnegie’s agenda around such. A few different inventors at that time came up with different designs sometimes borrowing ideas from each other.

It could be absolute BS… but it could also be the same paradox as when the owner of this site first judged NASA hippies attempting PEMF therapy for space research reproducing earths magnetic field in space for astronauts health… and then being pleasantly proved incorrect.

I can only say for myself that I feel really good after a session and that everyone that has tried it has reported feeling much lighter and full of positive blissful physical energy after and a sense of being rejuvenated. That is with the designs and devices that were designed by Nicola Tesla and Paul Marie Oudin https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Oudin_coil_-_Treatment_by_the_effiuvation_method.jpg

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/llustration-of-dArsonvals-sole-noidesnoides-dArsonval-1893b-with-thanks-to-the_fig1_232066716

I have tried both of these devices above and they consistently feel amazing. But having said that… I often feel very good. I have seen various testimonials by people that I have personally met that makes me feel that weather placebo or not… there is a significant portion of individuals that heal from strong health related issues.

I think this older technology is pretty interesting. I had a good look at some of the clinical plasma discharge and Tesla coil devices when I was in college. At that time of course they were museum pieces.

For as long as these things have existed (maybe about 130 years?) I think there is good evidence that they have been helpful for many people. Of course Flexner threw a wet towel over electro-medicine about a century ago, and we are still trying to recover from that.

My general opinion is that many of the manufacturers today are just copying the devices that existed a century ago, maybe with better materials, but functionally just a copy. I’m not saying that is necessarily a bad thing, but it does expose a deficiency when you ask the manufacturer a technical question. “Well, I copied it from a museum piece…” is not a very satisfying answer I suppose.

But like many older technologies, many of them still work fine, and I am interested to hear what people think about this kind of technology. I guess my only cautions are:

1 - Be aware of marketing hype and pseudoscience.

2 - Many of these devices emit massive amounts of broad-spectrum electro-magnetic interference. So, if you are EMI-sensitive, please be extra cautious with this technology. And if you are not currently EMI-sensitive it is possible that chronic exposure to excess EMI may increase your sensitivity. Mostly this potential risk remains unknown, but I think it is worth considering.

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This is why I am my self very cautious with those devices. Some work with lots of “Watts” and one manufacturer of such “tesla coil” etc. devices told me that there are antenna configurations that can do or transmit things, over a distance, which you do not like to be happen to yourself…

Others induce lots of Watts into your tissue. Supposedly to cause heating of (cancerous) tisse, which destroys some tissue, may trigger Heat-Shock Proteins (HSP’s), etc. and upregulate some repair mechanism, thus destruction of old cells to get some new ones and the like.

Can’t tell if people tell the truth, make some stuff up or are crazy anyway :mage:

At least I do not like to be the guinea pig of 100 Watts antenna trial-and-error development :open_mouth:

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Probably the most famous healing done by electromagnetic current was that upon Mark Twain by Nicola Tesla’s earthquake machine in his lab in New York… Permanently curing his digestive issues and immediately sending him to the bathroom.

Although for me the most modern and interesting high profile healing is that of high-powered PEMF therapy upon none other than Shaquille O’Neal… With him attributing high-powered PEMF with multiple NBA championship Rings.

Shaquille O’Neil:

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@TajD , This was shortly after undergoing chemo and radiation on my esophageal cancer tumor in 2016. Before treatment, it was the size of a golf ball, and after treatment, it was no longer detectable on pet scans. At that time, i was strongly advised by my oncology team to undergo surgery, which I ended up refusing. Thereafter, I did a bunch of holistic stuff, and the Theraphi sessions were a part of that.
So to completely answer your question, although the tumor was not detectable on scans, I was told my my docs that some cancer cells are probably still in the area, and might come back.

I love that! it looks cool indeed! I gotta say, that giant cage looking machine you posted above looks pretty awesome too!

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Yeah, it’s one of my favourites. You just lay down and turn it on and bliss out.

I have had the good fortune to try several such devices and felt zero effects, but I do find it interesting how many feel/see improvements. I wonder how much is Placebo. It sure does feel like something SHOULD happen when exposed to these fields.

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Platinum, that states in uses a compound wave form (sine and square combined). How does one know that they actually do use that waveform and if the perimeters are correct?

Thank you for your input. We are on the pre-order VIP list for the Stimul hat and are excited to try it.

Thank you for your dedication to the integrity of the PEMF industry.

At the same time -> “combined” (how should that work?) or after each other?

Sine wave has basically no effect based on the NASA studies. Low dB/dt.

You have to measure it and still don’t know what it does in effect.

Best,
Hans

First, thank you for bringing this question to the general forum discussion. I appreciate that you did that.

This is a valid question, don’t get me wrong, but it is pretty technical. So… I wonder… why are you asking it? Understanding why might get us closer to understanding the widespread fraud in the PEMF (and other “alternative”) markets.

My guess is that some PEMF marketer put it in your head that you need to use a “combined waveform”. Either in a sales pitch, or on a web site, or elsewhere.

This brings up several important questions:

Do you know what a “combined waveform” is? @hcf answered that well.

Was this pitched to you by a PEMF marketer? The sure way to know this is that any scientist or engineer would have started with a detailed, verifiable explanation of why a “combined waveform” has an important biological effect.

A marketer, on the other hand, would have just tried to dazzle potential customers with this technical jargon without explanation, or they would have said something evasive, such as “Studies have shown…”

OK, great, which studies? We would need verifiable scientific or technical references. Then we need to read and understand the references. So far, 100% of the time that I have been studying PEMF and the PEMF market (for over 30 years), the “scientific references” on offer from a PEMF marketer are one or more of the following:
1- non-existent
2- are just another advertisement, or an opinion on a blog or a claim on a web page
3- refer to a PEMF technology entirely different from what they are trying to sell
4- do not say what the marketer claims was said
5- are biased and/or non-reproducible pseudoscience

So, my guess, and I could be wrong so please correct me if I am, but I believe that you were told that you needed a “combined waveform” by a marketer, without reliable explanation, evidence, or proof.

I also suspect that you do not really know what a “combined waveform” is. There is no shame in this, it is electrical physics, and most people would not really know what it is. @hcf described it correctly. My explanation would be much more detailed, boring, and much less useful unless I am talking to an engineer or physicist.

But there is GOOD NEWS!

I happen to have extensively studied the biological effects of PEMF waveforms for about three decades. My work has been published, patented, and put into practice by NASA, several private companies, and is the functional core of the ICES-PEMF technology that I make and sell as “Micro-Pulse” products.

I sell this technology, so I have a bias that you need to keep in mind. But I give this information freely, on this forum, on YouTube videos and interviews, in scientific papers, at scientific meetings, and anywhere else where people ask me about it.

Here are my scientific findings:
The best biological effects are when you subtract or remove unnecessary waveform components. This is the opposite of “combined waveform”. It is a “reduced waveform” to its single essential component, the part that has a repeatable beneficial biological effect.

I describe this extensively everywhere and all throughout this forum. But briefly, the best answer that I have been able to find is that you can remove all of the ineffective waveform components, and retain only a single component that gives you the optimal beneficial measurable biological effects. The reduced waveform that is optimal uses a very short and rapid rise and fall of magnetic flux density, which I describe in detail throughout this forum (and pretty much everywhere else).

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And that still has to match the coil characteristics where the electronics output driver circuits have to be tuned to the coil resistance, impedance, L/C characteristics to produce an adequate wave form signal.

In addition the frequency pattern used has to have a useful biological component while being so “non-deterministic” or “changeful” that the body does not “stops to listen”, because that is what the body does when you have a constant background signal -> the body tunes this out.

ICES, stacked coil, Intensity 8-9, OMNI or B5C5 is a great achievement in my opinion!

Best,
Hans

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I believe @hcf is, as usual, exactly correct (and much less wordy that am)

Hello, do your devices use terahertz frequency and also are the human body cells voltage influenced to create more ATP in the mitochondria?

Terahertz?: no, Micro-Pulse ICES® PEMF is low frequency PEMF, generally at or below 100 Hz

Human body cells… create more ATP?: that is a basic biological research question. The answer is YES (for eukaryotic cells in general, not just human cells)

Does PEMF cause this to happen?: I would say “unknown” The science is unclear, and much of the “information” on the Internet is just marketing jargon. @hcf may know more than I do about current research on this topic.

Hello @Bob & @rayjay

I would be cautious with terahertz frequency, because this is “expensive” to do and used in controversial body scanners. The real health impacts are unknown and there seem to be “issues”.

What is “more ATP”? More ATP because of “stress” or more ATP because of a “less oxidative environment”? The body creates the amount of ATP that is “requested”, roughly the body-weight a day!

This depends on many co-factors, most important and most forgotten your thyroid hormone “T3”, which needs “T4” and a well working liver. You can eat what you want if you do not push down the “gas pedal”.

Two key factors for “pointing out” low T3/T4 are high cholesterol and high body weight. Reference values for free T3/T4 (fT3/fT4) are void, because they got lowered in the last 20 years to a point where the lower value represents a sick society but not healthy levels. In some labs the new high is the old average.

Best,
Hans

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