Flux Health Forum

Thoughts on Joints & Arthritis

from: Bob Dennis, owner of Micro-Pulse; I have a financial interest in the sale of PEMF devices, so please take that potential bias into account when considering my statements

I have used PEMF for my own joint and arthritic conditions, but I have not conducted any scientific studies on this use.

This is entirely anecdotal, but here is what I have seen and what people have told me:

I was able to significantly improve my right hip and avoided a replacement surgery, about 8 years ago.

I have been using it on my left hip and the progress is very slow but seems to be positive.

Members of my family and friends have had mixed results, some very good, some not much benefit.

About 200 people have told me they intended to use some form of PEMF for issues with their joints. Of these, several dozen have reported their observations to me verbally. I estimate about 2/3 of people who report to me have observed improvement. Some improvements were very significant. About 1/3 told me they had very little or no improvement. In most cases though, people did tell me that their level of joint pain was reduced so long as they used PEMF daily. I hypothesize that the use of any form of PEMF for joint/cartilage issues requires more time and persistence because these tissues are very slow to remodel. Nonetheless, the success rate for PEMF with joint issues appears to me to be lower than for other kinds of injuries.

Several clinicians have reported similar mixed results to me: some very good, some reporting not much improvement. In some cases, the clinicians used PEMF on themselves. In other cases, they used PEMF on their clients.

To help with joint recovery requires daily use for months, and a lot of persistence. To me it seems to make things slightly progressively better over time, instead of slowly getting worse. To me this is already a big improvement and a very good sign.

Some people expect immediate miraculous results, but I do not think that is a reasonable expectation, especially when cartilage is involved. It is unclear whether cartilage has a reliable regenerative capacity, some studies indicate not, and if PEMF does facilitate tissue regeneration then it would be expected to be very slow at best. But still I maintain that very slow recovery is far better than inexorable, slow degeneration.

I think if you plan to try this, you need to commit to daily (and night-time) use for many months or even years. You will need to be creative about coil placement and experiment to see what works best for you.

I am trying to get a set of before-and-after x-rays showing the thickness of my hip cartilage. Initial images show clear degeneration of the cartilage with thinning. I hypothesize that there is some cartilage regrowth, and perhaps this will be evident in the before-and-after images. I would eventually like to run a scientific study on this.

My questions for everyone: Have you had any success using PEMF for joint issues? Were you able to find any evidence of cartilage regeneration? What system did you use and how did you use it?

HOW TO HELP:
What we are looking for is as much information as you can share about your condition, how you used PEMF, and the results you observed. You can upload photos and documents as well as your text. The more detail you include, the better. You can come back later, edit your text to add more details, upload images, documents and test results, add helpful links, etc. Also, don’t forget to ask questions, because this will help people to share their observations and experiences that they may have forgotten to mention.

Share what worked and how you did it, but negative results are just as important as positive results!!! If you tried something that did not work well, this experience would help other people too. People respond very differently and have different levels of sensitivity, so something may work well for others, but not for you. What we need is a lot of different observations from many different people so that we can begin to see larger patterns and formulate general guidelines about what is likely to be helpful, what is likely to be wrong, which options should be explored, and which options can be avoided.

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I have been using the device on my left knee for about 1-1/2 years pretty diligently. I don’t feel like my condition has deteriorated during this time as the pain level hasn’t increased but would like to get an xray as I have xrays from 2015 and 2017. The xrays from 2015 indicated severe degenerative change of the medial femoral tibial compartment with mild to moderate left knee patellofemoral and femoral tibial compartment degenerative change (guess that means loss of cartilage). The xray from 2017 wasn’t diagnosed but it looks fairly similar to the ones done in 2015.

I’m hoping cartilage is growing as I am not wanting a knee replacement. I have been researching stem cells but need to be more convinced about the success rate.

I have the same basic issue with my left hip. PEMF in 2012-2013 seems to have fixed my right hip, but I have needed PEMF on my left hip for over a year. Without PEMF the pain is unbearable, range of motion is bad, and a replacement would be inevitable. With daily PEMF, as much of the day as I can (whenever seated or lying down) my pain remains at zero, range of motion is excellent, and I can get on with life. Also, PEMF seems to have stopped any further degeneration of my left hip.
An x-ray from a year ago shows clear cartilage thinning. I will continue to use PEMF and eventually hope to get another x-ray to see if there has been any regeneration.

Hint: when I asked for follow-up x-rays on my other hip and lower back to see the improvements, I made the mistake of telling my physician that there had been a great improvement. As a result, he refused to order an x-ray, saying it was no longer medically indicated. So, I have no evidence of earlier improvements, at least not x-rays before and after. Now I am smart enough to ask for a second x-ray to see if the condition is stable or progressing, without saying anything about the improvements. Next time I will let him tell me whether or not it is improving.

Its a sad situation when you are not even allowed to monitor your own body in our sick medical system. I wonder how future history will judge this idiocy, if we survive as a species…

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Early onset arthritis in right hip on a 33 year old. There was a time when I would go to work, come home and go right to laying in bed because of pain. Had a Lipogems fat stem cell procedure on my right hip done in October 2018 at Nerve Bone & Joint Institute in Washington DC (cost was $3,500.00, for those interested). Dr told me to wait 4 months before judging the effectiveness of the procedure and that the procedure would stop the arthritis for a minimum of two years. Pain improved approximately 30% after 4 months. I then learned about PEMF and tried micro pulse. I have been using Micro pulse since January 2019 day & night (the only time I don’t wear it is when Im showering). Pain is continuing to improve and is only really noticeable after doing a lot of walking. I am hopeful I started treating this early enough that I can try and reverse it.

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try to keep it up 24/7. Improvement is slow, but better than the knife for sure. Sounds like you are getting better, not worse… good sign IMHO.

Lived on Celebrex for 15 years because of arthritis in both hands and right knee, Used A9a diligently for 8+ months at night and when I could during the day. My doctor removed my meds (side effects of Celebrex) and I found that didn’t need them any more. I have been off all NSAIDs now for 4 years and use my new M1 on different parts of the body when any pain starts. I’m 68 years old and mostly pain free every day unless I do something stupid.

This is very similar to my experience. I handed a bottle of unused opioids back to my physician because I did not need them anymore after many years of severe chronic lower back pain which had gotten better with PEMF. He told me that was the first time he had ever heard of anyone doing that, but of course he still does not believe in PEMF. He said he would be happy to write me a new RX when my back pain returned. That was about 3 years ago. No pain since then, but I still use my M1 for my back every day just to keep things in good condition. I have not even had a minor back problem in that time, but long before that I had been throwing out my lower back every few weeks before I used PEMF.

In my opinion, when properly used, PEMF does take daily diligence (it is not a “quick fix”), but the results for me seem to have permanently fixed most problems of chronic pain, not just “blocked” the pain signal which would of course have made things worse over time.

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Hi Bob- Using PEMF technology around the clock, on yourself, how quickly did you see lasting results in your hip arthritis? You say it seems to have fixed your right hip. Everyone is different, but how long did it take you to see lets say 25%, 50% or 100% improvement in arthritic symptoms in your less symptomatic hip? It would be very interesting to see if you, or any one else, in the forum has improved Xray or MRI images. I intend on having new images taken next year and I don’t mind sharing when I do.

The first time I used it was on my right hip in ~2014. It was bad and getting worse. I used an early version of the model A9, most of the day, on HIGH, across my hip. At first, it only made the pain go away while I was wearing it, BUT the hip did not seem to be getting worse as it had either. After about 2 - 3 months, I noticed a slow improvement. By about 6 - 7 months of daily use, it had become much better and was clearly on the mend. After about 9 months the pain was gone, but I elected to wear it daily for another month or so, just to help the tissue fully recover even though the pain was gone and did not return. Since doing that, my right hip has been pain-free, for about 5 years now.

My left hip started really hurting in 2017, while I was developing the B5 and C5, so I waited a while to try out the C5. Big mistake, I waited too long, it got really bad, almost unable to walk, but then started using the C5 daily. As a result, the left hip has taken much longer, but it is improving, not getting worse, and I have been wearing and sleeping with a C5 daily for over a year now, about 18 months. Still seeing improvement, but not fully recovered on the left hip yet. But it has allowed me to walk and stand without much pain again, and I am certain it has allowed me to avoid a hip replacement, so the minor daily inconvenience is tolerable.

My progress started getting faster when I started stacking pairs of coils to get deeper field penetration, which really works well for me. Hard to describe, but done properly, you can stack coils side-by-side to get deeper field penetration. I will make a video of this, and we may start offering them on our website if there is interest.

Lessons learned: start early, use daily, day and night if possible, expect very slow progress, but the degeneration seems to stop, which for me is a huge plus.

I will try to get another set of images ordered by my PCP, but that can be tricky as I mentioned earlier. I think images would be very helpful. Will share if I can get them.

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“I started stacking pairs of coils to get deeper field penetration, which really works well for me. Hard to describe, but done properly, you can stack coils side-by-side to get deeper field penetration. I will make a video of this, and we may start offering them on our website if there is interest.”

There is interest. I actually use two units with stacked coils side by side on the front of my hip. I think thats what your talking about doing, but Im not sure. I’ll see what you say when the youtube vid comes out. Thank you for posting. This is very insightful.

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OK, we plan to start offering them on our webstore tomorrow (16 April 2019)

Deep Field Coils:

You will need a model C5 to use these, because the timing and polarity need to be correct.

We will start selling them with model C5’s and as accessories. They look kind of ghetto because we tape them together (sports tape, good quality), but they really work well for me.

Video may take a while, but they should be in the web store very soon.

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Curious to get more information on the stacked coils. Do these just offer more power? Do they need to be used at higher power settings?

They are stacked so that the magnetic pulses add, like more turns on a solenoid. The addition is not simply linear, the power and depth would be increased by about 60% by my measurements.

I use them at high power levels for my left hip. Everything else takes much less power. I find that the response for different injuries is highly variable.

I don’t think I articulated my question well. For these new stacked coils do you need to use them at higher power settings to get a benefit? Or do they offer a benefit at lower settings as well. I.e. Do stacked coils at lower power offer a benefit over a single pair of coils at a higher power?

can you elaborate on stacking pairs of coils?

They are intended to allow you to achieve higher peak pulse power for deeper field penetration to reach very deep tissues. You could use them at lower power levels, they will work, but that is not the intent.

Sure. The basic coil configuration is side by side (both bumpy sides facing the same way). Then I stack another pair of coils in the same side-by-side configuration on top of that. They end up looking exactly as shown, but note you need two PEMF pulse generator outputs that are synchronized to drive them. So you need a C5. A model A9 or M1 will not work because they each have only one output and it does not synchronize with any other device.

IMPORTANT: align the polarities so they add up to achieve higher magnetic field peak intensities. You can test this using the hexagonal coil tester if you know a bit about what it looks like when coils stack properly (place the hex coil tester between the stacked coils, the green LEDs should pulse even more brightly than normal).

This cab be a bit tricky to do, so we offer it as a service on our webstore:


By doing this, you get about 60% more peak field intensity, and a corresponding 60% greater depth of field penetration.

BTW, based on my calculations and real measurements, this configuration gives you a lot more focused power than any of the so-called “whole-body” PEMF mats I have tested. The deep field coil configuration lets you put all the energy where it is needed most.

NOTE: most people should not need this, it is only for the rare case where extremely deep field stimulation of very resistant injuries is required.

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thank you! This is helpful!

Several questions: In your opinion is the a9 the best c5 protocol for arthritic conditions (I’m assuming it is)? When using the deep field coils what is a power setting I can use while sleeping where I won’t risk damaging the device? Bought a c5 this morning.